| Where am I on the Israeli politics map? |
I made a little experiment today. I went to Tapuz forums, posted a brief of my political opinions and asked them whether I am Left wing or Right wing. To those of you that read hebrew, Read the original thread. I’ve translated my post and the comments to english for your comfort. (I might be translating things a little wrong, I’m not an english-born speaker…)
Also, some of the issues are domestic so if you’re not fimiliar with israeli internal affairs you might misunderstand them. That’s alright, of course… 
My Original Post:
“I need some assistance in defining my political location. For the matter I’ll summarize my stands and you’ll tell me what you think I am:
Palestinian State: It’s clear to me that there will be one eventually, I think they DO deserve a country but not while they haven’t proved they can’t prevent terror from their territory. Once they’ll show a real readiness for peace - absolutely.
Settlements in the territories: I’m not crazy about them. The places needed to evacuated to prevent friction - to evacuate. (Note: I mean the small jews blocks inside a whole-palestinian town). The guys at the Jewish settlement in Hebron I hate personally since my regular army service in that area, though I don’t think all the settlers are extremists or something.
Orthodox Jews: Let them choose 10,000 elite Yeshiva student to remain in the yeshiva, and send all the rest to the army or civil service immediately!
State and Religion: There SHOULD be a separation, but I still think religious holidays should be state holy days. I don’t agree for imposing religion but there must be respect to tradition. Not to approve opening stores and business in Shabbat. Yes to approve civil weddings (though I find them personally to be empty and doesn’t gives them respect). I’m against allowing to produce non-kosher meat in the country but I wouldn’t fight about it too hard. In favor of a constitution.
Terrorists: Targeted assassinations are the best, Yes yo hunting them fiercely, but it’s better to miss a hit on a none-ticking-bomb terrorist then risk killing innocent civilians.
The US opinions: Israel’s best friend. We should consider it’s opinions, absolutely.
Rest of the world opinions: If counting it’s opinion serves Israel in the short/long run - to consider it. If not - Fuck it. Anyway, it’s always better to fins a way between.
Leaders: Sharon - Handles well with the situation in Israel even though he doesn’t have any peace policy. He’s good at maintaining the country in a tolerable state when there’s chaos but isn’t capable to lead to and sign a peace agreement. Ben-Eliezer (”Fuad”) - I don’t know. I don’t like him, I would rather have Sharon. Nenatnyahu (Bibi) - God! If he’s elected that would be the most idiotic thing Israeli citizens had ever done. Not to learn the lesson from his previous term will be exactly like learning a lesson from Rabin’s murder. A small person looking for fights. Mitzna - a political Rookie.
At the moment I don’t see many options. It’s clear to me that Netaniahu will be a disaster, Seems there is no one standing out and worth voting for in the Avoda (Labor party), Sarid (Opposition leader, heads a Left wing party called Meretz) seems too Anti-Religious. All in all, I guess i would vote for Sharon again, even though he’s only good at putting off and managing fires but not in advancing for
solutions.
Jerusalem - I’m against dividing it. I would even rather see a national zone in the east of the city then to have any palestinian representation there, since Jerusalem is our CAPITAL! (and the city I live in). However, I’m aware we’ll have to do some painful give-ups in a peace agreement (though I still would demand some really really serious give up from the palestinian in exchange)”
And now for the comments: (I’ll add them as regular comments)
16 Comments so far
Leave a reply
"The guys at the Jewish settlement in Hebron I hate personally" ?!
Thanks to Hebron, Jerusalem and other we have Israel after 2000 years!!
What’s the connection between the settlers and the rising of the jewish people in it’s country?
They have no right in building the country - the opposite. The religious institute opposed Zionism in it’s begining and declare we should wait for the Massiah, and then where would be now?
The none-religious judaism, the zionist, was what brought the building of the state of Israel and with all respect to the religious institution, they were more parasites. The ones building the country were the Wall and Tower pioneers.
About the Hebron Jews, I agree with civax. I don’t know how old he is and when was he there, but 7 years ago I did a reserve duty there and from my point of view, I would leave these guys to the palestinians and throw them to hell. A bunch of delurious hooligans, Heros from behind tons of walls and the steel of the IDF. I didn’t like then and still doesn’t now. To remind you the sign hanged by the Kiosk owner in the entrance to Hebron - "No entrance to dogs and cops". He’s the first I would leave there.
((response to my previous))
I, too, got criticism on the behavior of some of the settlers and some of the rabbis there. I also have criticism on the Leftwing people
and certain leaders. But I’m not doing a generalization on all settlers or all leftwing people. When it comes to rights on building the
country, maybe you should check what was YOUR contribution beside doing reserve duty. The Settlers are the pioneers and the
builders of the last 30 years. Not all the religious people are anti-zionist Orthodox. Contrary.
Most of the leftwingers are loyal zionists, but among them there are those who act against the country and side it’s enemies on a
regular base.
About the residents of Hebron, I admit, there is a bunch of weirdoes no one can understand over there. It is not, however, diminish
the right of the jewish people to sit there and live there.
What will be the solution at the end? We’ll have to wait and see.
((answering the original post))
You’re not left-winger nor a right-winger - you’re just one of a very big portion of the citizens in our country, that are troubled with the
same problems, that think exactly like you on the same issues, and that with all the problems still loves this country for better or
worse - and knows inside that they will not live anywhere else.
YOu’re one of a big portion of citizens that hurt the inside situation this country ran into, from this reason or another, and that their
biggest dream is to see a change.
((answering the original post))
Stand beside me, my friend, cause you’re already classified as left-winger around here!
I’m trying to fight these labels, too, but without success.
I have the same hesitations as you, exactly!
And I’m interested in a strong central block!
And Arik Sharon is the best there is!
And it sickens me that some people miss Bibi!!!
A self claimed terror expert, writes books and confuses spokesman with leadership!
And the Hebronites are a bunch Hooligans in my eyes…
In short - like you!
And what will we be?
I’m "left-winger", "coward", "hates the IDF", "Arab lover" and "Gay", someone here [tapuz forums] promised he’ll shoot me, but I
insists on staying unclassified!
And I don’t have a clue who am I going to vote for in the elections, but there is still time.
And get a Bullet-proof vest, my friend. Good luck!
((answering the original post))
You have no values!
You’re not right-winger nor left-winger. You’re simply a man without values.
In all what you’ve written there wasn’t even a single value you’re willing to pay a huge cost for, even your life.
You’re looking for logical solutions, in minimal cost, for comfort.
((answering previous post))
A thinking man is a man without values!?
Only if he thinks with his right-wing site of the brain??
((answering previous post))
There’s no connection between thinking and values!
A thinking man got values, which are not logical, and does not depends on his thinking at all.
For example the value of freedom, religion, the dedication to the state, not using violence etc.
None of these values got anything to do with thinking, and you can’t accept or reject any of them logically.
A man of values is willing to fight for his values, to pay a lot for them, to sacrifice his life for them. The thinking job is only to find a way
to reach the fulfillment of those values.
Civax might be a thinking man, maybe even a genius, but it got nothing to do with the fact that in his message we saw not a single
value he’s willing to fight to his death for. Civax might be a logical man, but he is not a man of values.
((answering previous post))
Simply not true.
I do have values, the point is that fighting over the wrong "values" brings us exactly where Israel is now, with a 2 years of constant
fighting a collapsing economics.
I’m FOR living with peace with neighbors, but not life under terror. I’m FOR giving to the country (and between us, doing reserve duty
today, specially in combat units - is more volunteering then out of no choice), but I’m against exploitation of this or another part of the
society. I’m FOR letting each person living by his believes, as long as it doesn’t disturb other people from doing so themselves.
And you know what - I’m not looking for comfort, but I’m not going to sleep on stones just to avoid comfort. I simply ask for a sane
country with a promising economics and with the citizens able to concentrate on building this infant state. Don’t for get Israel is
practically a baby - we haven’t reached 70 while the US got more then 200 and the European countries got more then a 1000 each, in
that form or another.
((answering original post))
A pennyworth analysis:
Ok, here it is..
By all signs,
my friend,
you are
probably
…
Shhhh… Lets go over there…
You’re..
SANE.
God protect us,
If I were you I would be careful from expressing
these kind of opinions in public.
really dangerous!
((answering original post))
Narrow-minded and value-less, that’s what you are.
And if considering the world is "If counting it’s opinion serves Israel in the short/long run" then Israel should reach an agreement with
the UN that in exchange of it’s retirement from the UN, the organization will not have authority to discuss it’s matters!
((answering original post))
You’re a left-right-winger who hadn’t made up his mind yet.
((answering original post))
You are a S-h-e-e-p!
Yes, a sheep!
Going after everything the media tells him!
A great example how the media in Israel shape the opinions of the little man.
Lets analyze:
What’s the motto that we’re being bombard with the past 5 years, without any relations to what’s going on in real life? Rabin.
So we have to find some Rabin in his opinion, at least.
Remember the attacks on Netaniahu in the media?
This is something the SHEEP will also add to his political inventory.
BAD BAD BAD Netanyahu!
Orthodox jews? Yeshiva’s? To enlist to the army!
To jeopardize "innocent" palestinian civilians?
God forbids!
—————————–
Important to note that this person could not find any ideological or valued or logical justification to any of his claims. Why? Cause all
this penetrated his mind in a not natural way but sits there very clear.
Gebels had thought us good. There is big lie that you can’t make people believe in if you’ll repeat it enough times as the truth.
Hi, Civax, do you really need to be somewhere on a "political map"? What are such definitions worth anyway? This page shows: nothing. Thanks for demonstrating this
Ho well, I guess I’m better in other fields. I’m not going to bring any new hope to the local politics…
I’ll stick to computer graphics and let others run the country…
F*CK!!!I’m sorry its comments like these that make go nuts. THE SITUATION IS TOLERABLE?!! 650 dead with,20 a MONTH IS TOLERABLE? (I cant take this anymore I guess Israelies are suicidal)A Prime minister who is under the boot of the US,transfers billions to the PA,lets Arafat dance in Ramalla and lets Hamas exist in Gaza is your best choice? Your praise for the US sickens me. Rememeber Defensive Shield when they forced you to pull out and stip defending yourself or even now when they force you to ease the curfews knowing full well that this will result in increased terrorism. Oh targeted killing are a joke,as Hezbolla said Palestinians have invented human cloning before anyone,the leaders are replaced immediately.To defeat a popular guerrila war Israel HAS TO BE RUTHLESS, or IT WILL NEVER WIN. Look at history for God’s sake and see how much blood was shed in total wars where the whole populations were involved. This is total war.The so called "innocent Palestinian civilians" support the bombers, help them,dammit they are the bombers. They have to be hit hard enough,so that they never even consider to engage in terror.Either Israel inficts devastating casualties or the Zionist enterprise is over. this is a war for Israel’s existence God Dammit. You dont trust Nataniahu because he signed the Wye River accords well Sharon lied about negatiating under fire, he never delived "peace and security" and now he’s agrees to an eventual "Palestinian State".